Unstable

Hope this is what you're looking for. 98 total polys. I sure could have used more. Lol. shoe_03.c4d

I'd be interested

So, I take this to mean that other than subdivision, nothing else is permissible, like cloners and symmetry. An example that would not be permitted (if I understand): I make a quarter of a circle that contains 20 polys. I then use two symmetry objects to make it a full circle. I use a cloner to duplicate circles into a corrugated tube. This is would not be allowed even though the total physical polys used was 20. Is this correct? I have no problem if this is the rule, I just wanted to clarify this. Thanks

I've found that double clicking an island with the live select tool in poly mode within the UV editor seems to select all polies in the island. However, if the islands overlap and you double click them, you'll select both islands. But you can go to the model and select one poly from the island you want and then change the focus to the UV editor section and do the U-W to select the rest of the polies in that island. I'm not sure this works in all versions, but it seems to in S26.

I haven't done many UVs and thought I'd explain my process steps and ask if this is the best way to do it. (I doubt if it is.) 1. I mark the seams before subdividing the model 2. I unwrap the model, creating the UV 3. I adjust all islands using a UV map texture to ensure all look good (I redo steps 2 & 3 until happy) 4. I relax the UVs (because I'm going to sub-divide the model) 5. I may or may not Pack the UVs (if I don't, I manually place them in the space without overlap) 6. I then subdivide the model 7. I save current state to object 8. I save this C4d project (contains the low and hi-res version of the model) 9. I copy the sub-divided object to a new C4d project and save that project 10. I select various polys for texturing and assign each its own basic material (each its own color) 11. I save this project and export the sub-divided object as an fbx so I can import it into Substance Painter Is this the normal procedure for UVing a model and exporting? Thanks

I kind of expected that response but as luck would have it, I searched for the problem all day and a few minutes after posting for help, I find the resolution. I found the problem to be in how I made the UV seams. I cheated a bit. I loaded the model into 3dCoat and had it do an auto UV and examined the areas I thought were my issue. I didn't copy it exactly, but it helped me find the areas that I had over detailed with seams. I simplified the seam cuts and its almost perfect. Just a bit of stretching in one tapered area. Don't know why it tells me there is bad geo when the issue is really bad seams. I guess you get used to that. Thanks

I unwrap a model and the UV looks pretty good, but when I try to apply Geometric UV Packing with no checkboxes checked, I went to poly mode and selected all islands on the map and tried to Pack the UV, but I receive an error saying Pack UV Failed - bad geometry. I did a Mesh check and the only thing showing is 6 complex poles. When I unselect 3 uv islands it packs the uv fine minus those 3 islands. If I select only those 3 islands and try to pack, it works fine for those islands. What does this indicate? I'd like to give this a shot at finding the problem myself but could use some hints as to what to look for. thanks

I doubt this is possible but thought I would ask. Is it possible to remove recent files from the list of recently opened files that appear in the menu? When I'm working on a project, I typically end up creating numerous versions as I progress. For example, I start with project_00, then project_01, etc. Because I may work hot and heavy on one project for a while, I end up creating many versions. During this project, I might take a break and do quick project that only requires two or three versions, then I move to another project or return to one already in progress. As time progresses, my recently opened list shows 20 versions of one project, followed by 3 versions of another, followed by 25 versions of another and so on. This leads to a very messy process, if I jump from one project to another and if I don't open a project for quite a while, it may drop from the list completely because of so many versions of another project. It seems to me it would be very useful if there was a utility where I could say I want project_21 to appear in my recent list, but projects_00 thru _20 don't need to be displayed. Is there a file I can edit to do this? Or maybe it's the way I'm doing things that is the problem, is there a better approach? Thanks

I have the same issue. There have been a couple of times I was going to be a silver or bronze contributor, but when it prompts for Paypal, I just cancel and move on. If you can't take a credit card, I think that will reduce the numbers here too. But maybe I'm just an old fashion oddity.

Man, I'm still having modeling problems that seem like they should be easy to figure out. But apparently not for me. I simply want to extrude a rectangular shape from a disc while keeping the disc's round shape. I thought by moving the loops inward and keeping the outside edge intact, it would work, but no. The result when I subd it. Why is the outter edge collapsing? disc extrude sample.c4d

Thanks for the feedback. I'll keep things the way they are, except for the tris of course. Speaking of tris, there doesn't seem to be a setting in the mesh checker to spot tris. Is there another method or script available for spotting tris? Or do I have to rely on my eyes?

Well, I'm hoping I deliver something you'll be proud of Cerbera. Instead of following along with your video and making the changes as you explained them, I watched the video numerous times before making any attempt. Then without using your video at all, I tried to make similar changes. The first attempt wasn't great. I watched the video again. The second attempt was better, but back to the video I went. I seemed to get a little better each attempt I made, until finally, my results were very nearly the same as yours. I approached it this way so I might start 'seeing' what needed to be fixed. I was afraid if I just followed your video, I wouldn't really learn. Again, I really appreciate you doing the video. Thank you. So, what say we see if I learned anything? After my changes were similar to those on the video, I thought the nose indentation looked a little poly heavy and made changes there to reduce the polys. Then I flipped the ship over and began reducing polys on the bottom. And finally, I reworked the tail section intake and exhaust. I'm hoping I didn't go too far. Maybe the wings could also be lightened a little, but it seemed like too many complex poles to deal with. Before I move on to the canopy work, I wanted to see what you thought of my cleanup so far. I marked 3 areas that I'm still concerned with poly tension. I've tried several ways to eliminate the tension on the nose (green). The tension was there before I lessened the poly density and it's still there, although it might be a tad less. I've also tired various ways with the tail intake (blue). And I worked a little on the tail exhaust area (purple). What you see in the attached pics and project are what I would consider my best attempts of reducing poly tension in these 3 areas. progress_06.c4d

Good point. Probably not. Lol.

This is good information, especially since you're from Arizona too. Maybe I'll look into the T-Mobile solution. I'm kind of fed up with Cox. I finally figured out how they play you over time. When your bill goes up, they like to offer you the next faster plan for nearly the same price as the increased billing amount. Even though they mention this is a 'special offer', you may not realize how much that increased speed is when the 'special' pricing expires. If you ask to go back to the previous level, you're usually told that doesn't exist any longer and you'd have to fall back to way low speeds. You said you don't play games much. How much do you stream? I have an HD antenna to get local TV channels and stream the rest. This is what my Cox Internet is pulling. When I used a different server, it was about 100 mbs slower

WOW!! WHAT AN AWESOME VIDEO!!! This video is just what I needed right now! Thank you so much. I never expected to get something so valuable. I struggled through most of the day yesterday trying to get your flow, without removing those two splines of course, and could only come close. I would get down to the last row or two containing tri's and find myself in a bind. No matter what I did to get 4-sided polys, I'd end up with topology that I knew didn't pass muster. Honestly, I was at the point of accepting that I'm just not meant to model. Then to see this video showing how you handled this is priceless and has inspired me to keep pushing. I'll be watching this video over and over. I'm sure I'll come back to this video even when working on other models. I think I can use it to remind myself of how to look and handle things. Thanks so much!!

Thanks for the encouragement and I do understand that it's a long process of training my sight and mind. I was just about to post this when I saw your post, so I haven't really absorbed what you changed in in the image above. But it appears that you haven't addressed what I was going to ask about, so I'll continue with my post. I have reworked the area in front of the canopy to be exactly like yours (I think) and I believe that area is good. I'm in the midst of reworking the nose section. I'm similar to what you have, but I'm not finished and I don't think things are correct. I'm going to continue looking this over. But when I looked closely at your example, it appears that you removed or redirect one or both of the splines I have highlighted in the image below. These edges go all the way to the tail section, so if removed they will impact the tail topology. Do I need to rework the bottom of the ship as well to prevent this impact from occurring? Or am I missing something in handling the flow on top of the nose section? If I'm missing something, you don't need to tell me yet, but at the present I can't tell how either of these edges could be removed without impacting the tail. Thanks progress_05b.c4d

No problem, I thought it was funny.

Thanks again for all your feedback and direction. I'm sure at times, you'd like to smack me upside the head and say pay attention! Thank goodness for virtual learning. Haha. I will go back to the cockpit area first and do as you said by ( 'looking along the lines' and checking for contiguous curves is required there.") I'll try to see what you want me to. It's so hard to explain what is going on in my head when I'm modeling. It's like somewhere deep down inside I know that the poly flow should look like what you provided above. But when I look at the model, I struggle to see what needs done to bring it to that smooth flow, I can't seem to recognize the indicators that should be telling me to add, remove or spin a spline. Although my solution followed certain modeling rules, like making loops and using diamonds, my poly flow didn't look like that image deep inside my mind. But I guess I hoped it was right, so I didn't have to redo it again. Lol. Don't misunderstand me, I'm not whining or complaining, I'm just trying to share where my mind is at when working on this. I know that once I start really seeing those imperfections that indicate SDS stress and I know which technique to use to fix it, it will be much smoother sailing. But it's painful pushing myself to redo and redo and redo the mesh. Haha. I just thought I'd throw this comparison out there. I used to be a pretty good programmer (which has nothing to do with this), but I kind of compare modeling to programming. In a sense, modeling is visual programming. No matter what code you program with, there are multiple solutions to the problem. Some solutions are bad, which cause the application run slow or crash due to inefficient code. There is one solution that is optimal, which is the fastest smoothest and best performing code. There are also hundreds or thousands of other solutions that fall in between, which have a varying degree of success. In my opinion, modeling is the same thing, except instead of code, we're using polys. And just like when coding, the top programmers are able to see those indicators of bad and inefficient performance before actually running the code. I think that's what great modelers can do and I'm very thankful that one of the best, Cerbera, is taking the time to share his expertise with me and everyone following this thread. Even though I've messed around with 3d for some time, I've never really dedicated myself to completing one difficult model. And while this isn't the most difficult model for some, it is definitely a sufficient challenge for me! That said, @Icecavemanlet's not make this ship into a luxury liner with lavatories, snack rooms and bars. Lol. I was thinking of this being a single seater space cruiser/scout ship or fighter possibly, with a canopy that can open. While I think it would be great to do the instrumentation, I'm not sure I want to tackle all the instrumentation immediately after completing the exterior. I thought the order might be to complete the cockpit/canopy. Then figure out what I was going to do about the engines in the wings. And then determine what is behind the cockpit. Is that an engine or weapon system? I think it's a weapon system, but it seems odd for your only weapon to be pointed aft. I guess if you can outrun everyone, then it might make sense. Well, back to modeling and looking for indicators. 😁

First all, I'd like to thank you for all your continued guidance. I appreciate the time you're taking to help me learn this. Okay, I made my flow similar to yours, but now when I look at in SDS it looks like a bite mark. Lol. Maybe it looked that way before my changes, I don't think I looked. Here is the flow. It's a little different than yours, but not by much. I also tried to improve the nose flow, but I'm not sure I did it in a good way. Thoughts? Lastly, what is the best way to refine the canopy? Should I split it off and treat it as a separate object, like I think you'd do with a car door? progress_05a.c4d

Sorry that I'm moving along so slowly. I have a lot going on plus I'm not very fast at modeling anyway. Lol. At any rate, I feel like I've made some progress, but there is still plenty more to do. I reworked with tail (cone) section of the wings and behind the cockpit. I tried to make the poly flow cleaner and less lumpy. In addition, I added the indent in front and tried to create the seams of the nose section. I'll probably have to redo it. I don't think the poly flow is correct, but I think I'm on the right track. progress_05.c4d

I added it to the Splines menu like he suggested in the video but it doesn't work properly. When I click the grid spline icon the grid displays fine, but there is no Grid object in the Object manager. If I drag and drop from the asset browser it works fine.

The question is: Did I screw up by increasing the number of polies? I was very focused on the tail section behind the cockpit. While trying to make the engine or weapon compartment look right, I didn't realize that I increased my poly count. So now I have 2-3 times as many polys as I did in my progress 3 step. I found the point I was at just before the polies were increased. Should I drop back to the project: progress_3_and_a_half and redo the tail section with a lower number of polys? I probably should. It would probably be easier to work with less polys and prevent over saturation in an area when I subdivide. Thoughts? Looking at the good side of things (I think). I'm pretty happy with the overall poly flow and smoothness of the surface. The tail section still doesn't have that flair look that the drawing has, but I'm not sure I can make it look like that without going more nuts 🥜, than I already am. progress_04.c4d progress_3_and_a_half.c4d

I haven't had a lot of time to go back to this, but it's always on my mind. I jog (a really slow jog, mind you) 4 miles, 4-6 times a week. And now that my focus is on modeling I keep 'seeing' polys everywhere. I go past sections like this during every jog and all I can think about is the poor poly flow. Too many n-gons. Haha.

I'm not downhearted at all by your feedback Cerbera. You're just pointing out that I need to be more observant than I have been. I should have recognized the incorrect overlapping loops (A & B). I know as I gain more experience that I'll catch this in the future (at least I hope I will). I also knew those insets were messy and needed redone, but I never would have thought of using the solution you suggest. That's brilliant! I'll go back and try to resolve the poly flow. Thanks for your feedback. BTW should I be concerned about the number of edges/polys that are on the edge of the nose section? It seems like a very small thickness to have so many edges. thanks

Well, I'm back with a little more progress and concerns. Lol Things I'm currently concerned about are: 1. The edge of the nose section has 5 edges making it up and this seems like too many, but I'm not sure how to reduce the number without impacting wing. 2. I think I need to reduce the number of edges/polys used for the nose inset section. This was my first attempt and needs to be cleaned up a bit or redone 3. There seems to be a little unevenness just in front of the canopy. It's a little bumpy in subd. Not sure what is necessary to fix it. 4. I think I need more geometry for canopy so that I can round the corners more. 5. I have to work on how to make the engine compartment under cockpit section and blend in the wing. That should be fun. Haha 6. I also have to create the vent behind the canopy. I know I should be able to do it similar to how the inset was done, but I think I have to add more polys back there in order to make the vent. Bottom line: Still a lot of work to do. C4d file attached for anyone wanting to experiment themselves. progress_03.c4d