jbatista

Atention This version comes with an anoying bug. Each time we add an effector to a cloner (not dragging, just adding) it creates two of the same effector, duplicating the effect. Come on Maxon. Fixing errors its ok but please dont create new ones. You guys still didnt fix the keyframe bug in the re-effector. cheers

I wish i learned c4d sooner. i started to learn 3D in 2006 with 3ds max 06 (the first version with mental ray). At that time i thought that software was great, but in fact didn't had any experience in other 3d apps to compare. Later in 2014/15 a friend of mine challenged me to learn c4d since we were doing a lot of work for advertisement and tv, and 3ds max sometimes was a bit of a strugle to do more complex stuff. That was the best advice i got in my entire professional life. Learning this software was an eye opener and i realized that i simply spent way to much time in such a crappy app like 3ds max. Of course there were things in max that i missed but it in the end it really changed my career for the best. When comparing both apps, these were the obvious things that blew my mind when i learned c4d, and made me never go back again to autodesk c4d xpresso -vs- 3dsmax wire parameters c4d constraints -vs- 3ds max constraints c4d mograph -vs- 3ds (nothing) c4d sculpt sys -vs- 3ds (nothing) c4d bodypaint -vs- 3ds (nothing) c4d character rigging -vs- 3ds max cat and biped c4d object manager -vs- 3ds layer system c4d multiple object and property selection -vs- 3ds (nothing) c4d object morph system -vs- 3ds max morph modifier c4d timeline curve editor -vs- 3ds max curve editor c4d graph/gradient editor -vs- 3ds crappy graph/gradient editor c4d procedural worklow -vs- 3ds max clunky workflow c4d object based modifiers -vs- 3ds max stack (sometimes was good but i prefer c4d's) c4d learing curve/interface -vs- 3ds max learing curve and interface c4d modelling (this one was harder, since 3ds max was also good,but in the end i think i prefer c4d) things that i missed from 3ds max 3ds plugins (some were great) 3ds Slate material editor (very good) 3ds edit poly as a modifier (super usefull) 3ds some modelling tools and some from the ribbon 3ds max UV tools I the end the gain was so obvious that right now i really dont feel the need to return to 3ds max. Thats why i really wished to learn c4d way sooner. cheers

Hi Since Maxon is upgrading animation tools and timeline capabilities in the previous versions i really would like to see a better animation layer system. The Motion System in c4d has a huge problem that makes it unusable for me. Since its based on a Motions System Tag, it requires the hierarchy to remain unaltered through the animation. This is a big problem for riggers that need to constantly add stuff. Also a system for painting vertex weights with layers in order to be less destructive. Also how about some new sculpting features? Now that maxon owns a sculpting tool how about sharing some of those nice features and better performance. cheers

Hi there I have an idea from a different aproach. If your selections are already named test or whatever, there is a way you can filter them. In object manager go to view and choose vertical tags instead of the traditional horizontal ones. Now your tags are presented in a sub folder for each object. With the object manager search bar now write the name of the selection, and it will show only the ones you want. then you can select them or create selection objects if u want to make it faster next time. hope it helps cheers

Hey For everone that is interested in the insydium bridge for R23 and S24 Thank you Insydium!! https://insydium.ltd/products/bridge/

Apart from what we wish for this software we must be realistic and try to see what is MAXON's real goal and what should we be expecting. To do this we also must see what is happening in the other 3d software packages. C4d along with houdini is the main package for motion graphics and an industry standard in broadcast, advertisement, design studios, motion studios etc. MAXON will try to defend this status since it's the main profit branch so it will include more stuff dedicated to motion (scene nodes inluded) and also the reason why its buying red giant etc. Also c4d is know for it's easy approach so the stuff we'll see it's probably gonna be not very technnical. in my opinion MAXON will try to consolidate its presence in this side of the industry in order to keep blender away and to distinguish itself from houdini, since its an easier and more compreensive software. the other commercial software packages are kinda doing the same. in their own game. Autodesk 3ds max is boosting its modelling tools and also developing better material editor in an effort to maintain its status as modelling and render king. However, it relies in two major 3d party softs. Vray and recently tyflow. Without those two max is just and old software with good modellling tools but nothing special. Also autodesk is not introducing nothing new besides these features. max doesn't have a decent take system, nor a decent xref system, nor volume modelling etc. The list goes on. And you have to rely on lots of third party software. Maya is the same, they boost rigging/animation tools since its main business but besides that i dont see much. They dont upgrade their motion graphic tools , or everything else. and its crashes a lot (kinda buggy) Houdini is the main competitor for c4d in my opinion. apart from modelling, sculpting and character animation and rigging it is a stronger software but its hard to learn, and is a lot slower to produce results comparing to c4d in small advertisement projects. However i think they favour the development of vfx tools apart from anything else, since its main profit . Basicaly every company do the same as MAXON. They develop their software according to their commercial needs in order to defend their status in each industries, and if that status is gonne that software is as good as dead. We all want better tools that can do everything and in the end to pay the lowest price as possible. I think its very difficult to do that. Sometimes it's just better to learn a second soft and use it to complement (if needed). For motion graphics / advertisement etc, c4d will be a safe bet and with good tools. For everything else i think it will depend. My guess is that character animation will receive some better tools also. (and i hope) cheers

Now that i'm spending much more time rigging and animating there are two things that i would love to see some upgrades: A nice animation layer system that can work without the obvious limitations of adding or removing objects from hierarchy (motion tag has a serious problem when we need to add things to our rigs and destroy our animations). The other is an overhaul of xpresso, in order to make this system faster. Multithreaded would be nice :). And if it is not asking too much, some changes in the priority system. Those things sometimes are a drag. and now that MAXON invested money in a sculpt app, what about some sculpting tools updates ? that would be sweet as well. as for the renderer i dont mind having redshift as optional instead of integrated. I think its better to let users decide if they want it or choose another one. (unlike autodesk that make pay for arnold even if you dont use it in your pipeline). but they should reduce the price of packages in order to make users feel tempted to try it. cheers

Hi I work in a small studio in Portugal and we use in our pipeline 3 software packages. Houdini for vfx, 3ds max for rendering and cinema 4d for character animation and motion. We have several licences and by far the c4d license is the cheapest one. Houdini fx costs a lot and 3ds max is like 3 times more than c4d plus the ton of expensive plugins it takes. Plus the c4d license is floating wich is very good since houdini and 3ds only allow a limited number of seat changes. The way i see it, since this is a professional tool i dont mind to pay because it will generate income. In fact, i'm much more pissed that some tools in c4d are old and in urgent need of an update (render engine, particles, painting and sculpting tools, etc), than having a low budget version of it. cheers Joao Batista

Hi @Igor I also sent you a PM. I hope you received it. btw can we see the pm's we already sent? i'm trying to find it but i don't know where they are... Cheers Joao Batista

HI There is also another solution if you wish to try. You can create an edge along the middle of your geometry. select that edge and convert it into a spline, and then : menu > character > convert > convert spline to joints. (each point will get a joint) If the alignment of the joints is not good, run the character/commands/joint align tool command. hope it helps cheers

Hi The issue with the sculpting module performance doesn't seem to be solved. i've tried sculpting a small object with 6 million polys and the performance is not very good. In R21 the performance is still better. The main issue is that the brush gets really slow when stroking the object surface and in the end becomes really bad to use. Each time i press the brush this message appears -initializing vertex buffer object -for 1-2 secs and in that time the brush doesnt work so it becomes really anoying. I really like these sculpting tools and i would like to see this issue solved... Cheers

i agree 100% with this statement and i want to add a litte more. Even if the tools in c4d seem outdated (and in many aspects they are) try to check some making ofs from big anmation studios. Most of the time they are using old versions of maya , some of them are like maya 2012 or similar. Of course they have TD's in their pipeline to solve and implement custom tools but the the core is always something that they rely on instead of the newest release. C4d sometimes behaves like houdini. We can try and mix diferent modules to enhance certain capabilities. That means that we have to create most of our solutions and there are no presets for this kind of stuff. I love to mix mograph in rigging. It's just amazing . But there are even more things that are really good: Pose Morph tools are super powerfull in the rigging process and really worth it to explore.

Cinema 4d has good tools for rigging. Besides 3ds max and a bit of maya i dont know much about other packages but i feel very confortable rigging in this one. Obvisously i would like some improvements in the skinning system, maybe a multi layer system for the weight painting and a better constraint system that wasn't much of a drag with priorities. Unfortunately i'm mainly a generalist and i only rig occasionally, so there are a lot of skills (including learning python) that i miss. However it's good to work in a system that have such potencial and it helps a lot professionals like me that are not fully dedicated to rigging. For example i watched some rigging maya tuts and i find that if your are not a python user, you don't go very far... Perhaphs blender is better, but like i said it before, don't know it very well. Another thing that i really like is that we can mix mograph tools with rigging tools and provide some cool effects, and i dont see this kind of interaction in other packages. Here's a an example of some of those rigs i've worked, and to show that c4d is a good tool to use. A lot of xpresso but no python at all. enjoy:

Sry everyone. My bad, my confusion. (by the way i do not work for MAXON). What i mean is perpetual can stil be upgraded even if msa is gone. That's what i meant to say, but choose bad words. So wat i really wanted to say is, if you have a Perpetual license and if you plan to use your software in a long term, i think is still worth the upgrade. sry again, poor choice of words. and by the way, if i was someone working for MAXON, i defininitly should be recomending you to go to subsciption, and also that S22 is a great release when in reality it is not, just to clear some confusion.

I really think people shouldn't drop their MSA, or strike deals with MAXON just because they're releasing a subscription only update. In fact MSA's can be renewed after the release of R22 like always. For new users subscription is probably a more interesting option, but for old time users with MSA, things didnt change that much (probably prices). This S22 actually is more of a beta than a production ready version. It's filled with bugs and performance issues , so i don't recomend professionals to use it and to rely on it. Bugs like the sculpt system that is completly messed up (send an email to MAXON, and they are aware of it) and some bugs related to performance issues also. This version is nice to see some of the new features that will appear in the next R22 release, and hopefully with all the other bugs fixed. I used a trial version, checked the new features and now i'll wait for the september release. For me it's more important a stable and complete release than just a superficial one with stability problems. So for everyone with MSAs, just be a little more patient. Don't rush to convert your license type unless u prefer subscription model. Things didnt change that much, and in september we have a decent version to use.

Windows has other options. It could either evolve to directx like 3ds max , or vulkan.

Well, i hope when it comes to august during the R22 release (for everyone) they fix and correct some of these isues i mentioned before. I dont think its good pratice to replace old technology with some new tech that dont bring any significant improvement. I really like their uv update, but uvs for me it's just 5 to 4% of my total work in c4d, and looking to a crowded viewport is 90%. So i'm biased to say that i really prefer viewport performace, and not this. The sculpting module for instance, it's terrible! a simple sphere with 2mil and it almost doesnt work! what have they done? why it's so slow comparing to r21? I'm starting to like when they don't change nothing but keep the system running fine, to this... Right now i'm using the s22 trial since i'm on MSA. Perhaps it's a trial issue, but my guess it's not. If you know a way to report these bugs/issues to MAXON please tell me how to do it. i find this very frustrating.

These numbers between versions are very weird. For an instance, i have an Intel i7 5280K at 4.2 (OC) 64 gigs RAM, Nvidia 1070 Ti 8gb + 970gtx (for gpu render aux) with latest drivers, plus 2 ssds to installation and cache . It's a decent machine, not brand new but i find weird that i have much better performance in other modules of r21 than in s22. Problems i found so far: i found that the new modelling core doesn't include the sculpt system. Somehow the sculpting in s22 it's very bad with +2milion pollygons. In r21 i can sculpt with 4million super smooth and sometimes in 8million with some laggy but still works. In s22 it's impossible. Right now i cant get more fps from this viewport than from r21. It's simply the same. Don't get me wrong, i was not complaining about r21 being slow, but now, advertising better performance i find that bad publicity. The system in s22 seems to work better with more objects. Yes, it handles 8000 clone cubes better than r21 but i tried 1000 cubes wich one with 1000 polys and s22 became sluggish. in fact became slower then r21 in timeline playback. it looks it cant handle heavy geo. only quantity. not good I found the un triangulate tool updates not that usefull. i triangulated a simple hexahedron, and it couldnt untriagulate it back decently. but i've might done something wrong in the process. It seems that this update was meant for mac users. bah I still not tried the uvs. i hope it works better. But so far i find these updates really messy. MAXON doesnt use to fail like this.

I've tested S22 along with r21 in terms of performance. I think both viewports are equally matched. R21 sometimes seems faster and sometimes S22 behaves a little better. I also confirm that both versions provide different values in HUD triangle count and that seems strange. I've uploaded a simple test file. its a sculpt head cloned in a 150x150 grid. The FPS from R21 were about 4.4 against 3.3 from S22 (all frames off). The same file was used in both versions Also the viewport quality didnt seem to be that good. It's a little better perhaps, but not enough to be mentioned as a big upgrade. I guess this was not the kind of upgrade i was expecting, and i hope MAXON is aware of this. I also hope this upgrade was not just for the mac users. c4d_s22_test_v02.c4d