everfresh

„It´s like painting & when I want to have a look on my Picture I have to pay“ well, actually it’s not. it‘s like painting and having to pay for paint and brushes again if you wanna change your painting ;)

i‘m all for that. cv should be available to everybody who spent money on c4d, regardless of the model they choose.

also wasn't aware of that, from other posts it sounded like you would convert to a subscription and your perpetual r21 would be gone. that's actually very good news.

@RBarrett thanks for clearing that up. i got that also wrong from your previous posts.

i agree with dan, IMO it would be a good idea to make at least the tuts on cineversity available to everybody. it's the best place to get familiar with new features and to easily find tutorials for current problems you're facing. whenever i'm using a feature that i can't wrap my head around instantly i go and look it up on CV.

@Rectro that's exactly how i understood everything, too.

i think you thought correct. i get that statements made by MAXON are a little confusing and not very clear. what i get from it is this: 999$ is the upgrade price for NON-MSA customers. MSA customers can renew MSA before august 31st and "can lock in for the next 2 years", that means in my logic that you get r21 for the price of current msa, and you will also get r22 for the price of current MSA. after that, nobody knows yet. @RBarrett please correct me if i'm wrong.

afaik multiple installations of different versions should still be possible and it was also stated somehwere that you can download at least the most recent 2-3 versions on their site and get active support for it.

@Cairyn in my understanding of things you will get bugfixes, just as usual, but what will be exclusive to subscribers is eventual new features mid-cycle... but no one knows if and how often that will be during the course of a year.

one thing that’s probably most important for any animator out there : improved timeline performance. here’s a link showing the difference between r20 and r21 (first r20, then 21)

why the jealousy? i'm also a msa customer and i'm happy for all the prime and whatnot users that get this gift. think about it, they all had to deal with the stripped down versions of c4d, and now they get studio. i'm happy for them. and also keep in mind that they will have to pay more in the future than they did up to now, and for some of them that poses a serious problem, and they might not even need the studio features. so to me it is quite fair that they get a more significant discount during the conversion period. and for existing studio msa customers nothing will change for 2 years. you get your full perpetual version for you to keep for the price of current msa.

@RBarrett, thanks for your answers, but there’s one question you haven‘t answered yet that everybody wants to know: how much will perpetual upgrade cost be after the msa conversion offer... so let’s say perpetual upgrade from r22 to r23? will it be something around the lines of current msa price or significantly higher? i think that’s what most people are worried about right now. also a clear statement if perpetual is here to stay or if there’s any plans to move to sub completely in a couple of years would help. edit: never mind, found your answers on cgtalk on those questions. i guess it's somewhat understandable that you can't make those long term commitments at this point because you don't know yet how current changes will pan out and how the market evolves. kind of unfortunate though, would have calmed a lot of people down. for my part, my faith about the good intentions at MAXON hasn't changed at all, and i welcome the move in general. an additional flexible sub model is a must have nowadays for a software company at that scale.

there IS still the option to choose perpetual, at this point no one is forcing you to do anything. and nobody said perpetual will go away. that is your assumption. nothing more. maybe you are right and it will be the case someday, but nobody knows right now, at least none of us. so why act as if this is a sure thing? ah, yes, i know, because it was the same with adobe and your gut tells you. but that's not a valid argument. MAXON is MAXON, and adobe is adobe.

oh so i now don't have a moral code because i question your generalisations? do you know any of the people you were judging? yeah, i know, you don't need to, because you're a know-it-all and so full of yourself. grow up, you're way too old to be a child.

what a clever play of words. it's starting to get childish now. labelling people as "good" and "bad"? really?

why is everyone so sure about the forced subscription thing? no one from MAXON has ever said perpetual is going away nor do we know for sure what upgrade prices for perpetual will be. why jump to conclusions at this point? what if upgrade prices will be fair and cost no more than current msa? what exactly has changed then for studio msa owners?

odd. MAXON UK for instance stated that they don't have official upgrade prices yet. tbh it's a mystery to me why that wasn't figured out and communiucated upfront.

again. nobody knows yet what the upgrade prices for perpetual will be. if they are higher than current msa, that indeed would suck. but we don‘t know yet.

your r20 works with the old licensing system, it doesn‘t phone home, it will work forever, no matter if you choose to go sub or perpetual. i guess in the future it will just be similar to other sub based softwares, that you can only download the most recent 2 or 3 versions, and support stops for earlier versions. just like adobe can‘t stop me from using my cs 5 or cs6 if i want or need to (i don‘t, but i could).. but i can‘t expect support if i use them. that’s all.

why wouldn’t your r20 license not work anymore?

regarding the adobe sub: adobe creative suite updates were 1500€ for an update for the master collection. it's 600€ per year now for what was in in the master collection plus a gazillion apps i don't use, but could if i wanted to. i always have the most recent version, no compatibility issues with colleagues (especially after effects was always a pain in the butt). my numbers could be a little off, since it's been a while since i payed for an update for the master collection, but it's definitely cheaper now. in case of adobe, if you have been a master collection customer, the subscription model was fantastic. and the deal is really good. i use around 7 of their apps on an almost daily basis, for 50€ per month that's 7€ per app a month. you really can't beat that. as for c4d personally it doesn't make that much of a difference to me. i use it every day, i make money by using it, costs now 50€ more per year and has the benefit of getting in between updates. IMO they should have made it a little cheaper though. would have toned down the outrage. i get that people are a little upset, but i still have hope that upgrade prices for perpetual will be fair, hasn't been announced yet. and again, regarding the features: r21 affects my daily work way more than r20, and i'm not the only one. people were so happy about r20, and yet i haven't seen much people using fancy fields setups and crazy volume builder stuff. don't get me wrong, fields and volumes are awesome, but significant speed and workflow improvements are much more essential for the average 3D artist doing daily work.

as far as my knowledge goes if you renew your msa before 31 of august, you get r21 and discount on subscription for the next 2 (i think) years... but better ask your distributor, they should know for sure.

what puzzles me in general: why is everyone acting as if it was subscription only from now on? there‘s still perpetual and afaik upgrade prices for perpetual haven‘t been announced yet (IMO a big mistake to not announce that right away). what i do get though is that prime/visualize/broadcast users are pissed, since they will have to pay more in the future. but for studio users nothing much has changed. worst case scenario is we would have to pay like what, 50 or 100 more a year to be on the most recent version. if you ask me i think they should have made subscription a liitle cheaper even, so you save some money compared to msa. kept upgrade prices for perpetual same as msa. then most people would have been happy, but if you think about it, they are „only“ 50 to 100€ per year off with their calculations. is that really that much of a dealbreaker?

new auto weights are very good. we have heat map algorithm now as well as volumetric. also you can combine certain methods and also load in custom algorithms. check this twitter post:

more frequent updates are to be expected. no one knows how many throughout a year though up to this point.