BoganTW

TBH I'd find it annoying if someone dug up comments I'd written nearly two months ago just to use it anew as a cudgel.

I see links citing last year's M1 chip as 7608 in multicore mode. In the above video the M1 Max gets 12173.

Interesting C4D, Blender, Redshift results here. Turn the captions on for English subtitles. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nJK2m4YIK4s

We're probably more in agreement than not. All the things you listed in that first post sound good. I'm maybe less sceptical than you of the stuff cited in that next post. That's all fine. I'm probably less bothered about having my computer remain King of the mountain for years thereafter. I just want it it to work reliably and somewhat decently. A solid Mac should do both of those for me. If you do get a Mac mini please chuck Blender on it at some point and let us know how it travels, I'm assuming it will be decent (though maybe 16GB Ram will be an issue) but would still like to hear what you think. I don't think a dirge is needed with C4D discussions, would suggest maybe Hall and Oates or (if in a snappy upbeat mood) maybe Royksopp.

I'd only use the tests Ritchie did as evidence of the stuff he tested. And as a video editor the stuff he tested is of interest. I'm not interested in what Nvidia and LG are doing, so I'm not sure what an expose of those companies has to do with what Apple is up to. Is Apple a different company, or the same company as them? I thought it was different. You say that Apple 'of course' does the same thing with their dedicated reviewers. I'm assuming the long sentence that you added in quotation marks as being said by Apple, is fictional, isn't referenced anywhere, and is just your imaginative take on what might be going on behind the scenes. That's great. Fiction is fun and it's always nice to read things people have made up. But I'm interested in real world results and data, and both Ritchie and Stallman provide data on the tests they did in their reviews. If you come across a different test elsewhere that says they got their numbers wrong, feel free to link it. Is the M1 Max 'of course' being fast at certain encoding and decoding meant to be a bad thing? I thought it being fast at those things would be good, not bad. You also note that it doesn't say much about overall performance. I would have thought it said plenty about the overall performance of those particular tasks. Side note. I don't care about the upcoming Mac Pro, and don't care that a PC equivalent with some great new graphics card added might be as fast, or faster. I also don't care about Blender, and don't care that the use of C4D on these machines will involve both Maxon and a software subscription. None of these things bum me out. I'm assuming that these new machines will be faster than my 2010 iMac, won't crash a lot, and will get decent performance to my needs. So regardless of the sad violin you frequently bring into these threads. I view the glass as half full and will be happy to grab an iMac in a few months if they chuck one of these chips into it.

And a crazier test of pro apps at the end of this one. Hopefully some dedicated C4D tests will turn up soon.

Opening segment covering video rendering is worthwhile.

From the sound of it Maxon didn't need Apple techs to walk over and show them how to get C4D working well on M1 hardware as the Apple and C4D guys were already in tight communication. But Blender fully tuned up on Apple Silicon does seem like a no-brainer for people to at least try once they have the hardware ready. It might click for them. I hope you do get a MacBook or Mini at some point as you'll be in a good spot to give impressions on how it all goes on that hardware. Though (knock on wood) I should be able to offer my own impressions in a few months. I personally hope as much 3D software as possible gets fine tuned to run nicely on Apple Silicon, not just C4D and Blender but the other big apps as well.

I thought the segment was more designed to suggest C4D will run faster than before on the new hardware, than it did on the old. I'm assuming this is true, unless anyone wants to argue that it will run slower. Blender users will benefit from the new Macs. C4D users that get the new hardware will also benefit. I dunno if Maxon arguing this that this is the case is silly, or deceitful, or lame. Possibly it would have been more silly if Maxon had taken out a big ad telling people to go use Blender instead, which almost seems to be what you're arguing here. It would be logical for the Blender Foundation to make this statement, maybe less so for Maxon to bother doing it. I do not see how C4D running nicely on the new Macs, and Apple and Maxon celebrating this, is somehow a bad thing. C4D was first 3D app out of the gate to be optimised for M1, and they didn't need a grant from Apple to get there or stay there. To keep things agreeable I'll note ICM is right and if Blender is optimised nicely for these new machines, it will be a really good thing for Blender users. And I think the optimisation is more of a done deal now that Apple is stepping in - I recall months after an earlier Blender announcement circa the M1 launch a thread or two posted at Blender Artists were noting, has that M1 code been installed into the software yet, oh I thought Fred was going to do it, maybe Bill can do it when he gets a chance, or else we can wait a while, it'll get done soon I think, surely they won't leave it for a long while without finishing the task, guys? etc etc. Somehow I don't think the Maxon guys at Friedrichsdorf run things in quite the same manner, which might be why Apple thought Blender could use some extra cash and a pat on the head to help them along with the task, while Maxon was already there a year ago - which might also explain why Maxon and C4D have been invited onboard Apple presentations the past year or so. The suggestions that this is all a slick advertising move implies that Nemetschek put their hands deep into their pockets to grab pride of place in Apple's global keynote, and tbh I wasn't aware that Apple was that strapped for that they were putting sections of their keynote up for sale. But if Apple thinks Blender is the future of 3D this will be borne out if they tout Blender to the same degree in future presentations - something they haven't felt the urge to do up till now.

I’ll happily take that loss not to go near Windows ever again.

I'm still using my iMac from 2010. It's long overdue for replacement but it's still ticking along. None of the PC's I ever had managed anything near that amount of longevity. I understand things may be better now, and that the ease of replacing parts, RAM and whatever brings additional benefits for anyone wanting to upgrade their PC. Just for me though I'm glad there are Mac options coming back again that look decent. I'd guess the new latest Apple silicon chips would run great with Blender, and would do ok with Houdini if SideFX ever look at getting things working on it - they might and they might not, who knows. But I wouldn't assume the various industry professionals popping up midway through the Apple video to tell us how happy they with its performance would be doing so if the machines ran like crap. There will surely be tons of benchmarks and comparisons and stuff online in the coming weeks too.

It is a lot of money. The 'woooo! I have a Mac and I like it!' feeling usually comes some months later.

Yeah I much prefer Mac but I’m guessing AMD might deliver something cool. Lisa Su could do something. I dunno about the Intel guys.

Everyone has presumably seen this already but I thought it was worth noting. C4D was featured heavily in the Apple presentation today, getting a couple of shout-outs, having Philip Losch appear on camera, and presenting a couple of cool animations that were evidently made for the show. They mention how C4D and Redshift are three or four times faster on the new MBP's. The presentation was effective enough to convince me to buy the iMac that features the nearly year-old bog-standard M1 chip, because by the time I learn enough to outgrow it, there will probably be an M2 series (at the very least) already on the market, and I'd rather spend the savings on a let your hair down trip to Bangkok and SE Asia or something. But I'm impressed how Apple and Maxon seem to be good buddies these days and when I picture how a Maxon One sub will look on one of those colourful iMacs in the near future I'm happy.

I think either one will take bloody ages to learn but Houdini seems way ahead in what you can actually do once you learn it.

Very cool, will watch this week.

No word yet on Apple Silicon compatibility? It would be nice to see.

You may have already seen this. Noseman did a series for Youtube discussing tips and techniques for making video training. It's fascinating to watch.

I think it will be a fun and successful series. I also think maybe breaking the videos up a little (ie “That’s the first section done, now we’re going to use a different method for this next part” etc) gives you a brief opportunity to cut away from the software interface and back to your cam as a full screen. This makes longer videos a bit easier to digest, something I’ve occasionally appreciated when watching other tutorial videos.

I’ve seen keyboard software mentioned elsewhere but forget which one - maybe others know? I thought the video was really good and your speaking tone is quite pleasant and friendly and agreeable. I thought there was a small audio issue at points where the sound seems to cut out(?) right after some of your words, which makes the narration somehow seem a bit staccato and abrupt at points. This seems like a mic issue or something to do with the audio settings, but I’m listening on cheap iPhone earbuds right now and might have misheard it. I still found your video useful nonetheless. This will be a cool and helpful series if you can do it.

IceCaveMan - all is cool. Your earlier points about C4D releases were well argued but I note you cited R21, R22, R23, R24, R25 and called them five releases. They kind of were and they kind of weren't, right? As two of them had an S at the beginning (22, 24) and represented half a year of effort. Either way your points were well argued and I concede that some folks looking for various updated features though that period didn't get the results they hoped for. Maybe next year hmm?

Not trying to pick a fight at all. Hopefully everything will stay friendly. You mentioned I should check his Twitter. I did and it says This tells me he likes making art, and he also sometimes develops software. I'm pretty sure he wasn't a CEO or chief financial officer or advertising exec for the company. My understanding is that he did some coding for them. This is just to reiterate that I'm still as puzzled as I was at the beginning that you would say a guy who was a coder, wasn't one. Everything I've encountered today suggests the guy who did that coding, was one. Let's move on. (BTW if this thread had a soundtrack I'm pretty sure it would be the Muppet Show version of 'Mahna Mahna')

I don't consider myself a professional cleaner when I clean my house, no. However, if I spent a couple of years cleaning someone else's workplace, giving updates on Twitter as to how the cleaning is going, giving a half hour presentation at a conference about the cleaning I was doing because everyone thought it was important, and doing all those things because up to that point the workplace in question hadn't been able to get a cleaner to do the cleaning as well as I was able to clean it - I would probably consider myself a cleaner. 'Professional' is your word, not mine, but I'm not sure why you chucked it in there. Was he doing any coding, or wasn't he? This is not a burning issue requiring weeks of back and forth to wring nuance out of each point, but your general argument seems to be, despite doing a lot of coding, Pablo wasn't a coder. And my argument is, Pablo was a coder, and the reason he was a coder, is that he did a lot of coding. This doesn't rule out him doing other things throughout the week, in his spare time, or as a main focus. And I understand he hasn't left Blender to take up some amazing new position somewhere else as a coder. He's an artist. But your comment suggested that an artist who had done a ton of coding over a year or two to general acclaim hadn't done any coding, and I think that he actually did. And maybe it's possible to be both an artist, and a coder. I'm assuming he didn't tidy up the Blender code by drawing a sketch of what he thought was required, or gave a critique of the code quality through interpretive dance. He tidied up the Blender code by coding a bit, and if he did a lot of coding to do that, then I think it's actually alright to call him a coder, and no-one will be hurt, injured, murdered, or generally left in a bad mood if he is given this term.

So what was he doing when he was working on the Blender code for a year or two. Gardening? If he can jump into the code of a 3D software app and improve it to pretty much universal acclaim, he's probably more of a coder than most people. That said if he walked because people were bugging him to do more than he was able or wanted to do, that's fair enough. Maxon could tell all their developers to hold regular public meetings about their work, plans, schedule and productivity, and make them go sit in the naughty chair without breakfast if Fred Random from Reddit was unhappy with what he was seeing, but I dunno if it would help to be honest.

The unspoken assumption is that they're working to eventually put all those into the app - redo dynamics, update the particles, maybe even do fluids if they're feeling generous. But none of those were possible in the way that they would have liked with the old core, so they decided to do a new one. It's hard to see the new core and a decade worth of efforts towards it being designed to present nicer caps and bevels or more cloner spheres in future GSG tutorials. Ditto that object tracking, motion tracking from several years back. Maxon stuck Pyrocluster into the app way back in the day (before many University age students were born in fact) so someone eons ago must have once liked the idea of effects in C4D. And Stu Maschwitz, now running a bunch of stuff at Maxon, is also an FX guy. But I don't see those cool things happening till they've done all their core stuff. Which is maybe 2023 or 2024? Who knows. Chad Ashley's long sigh near the end of his R25 recap maybe reflects your thoughts. But whatever. They'll get there eventually. Blender's 'everyone gets their say/everyone wants to be heard/users speak directly to the devs/devs have to justify everything they do each fortnight in public' system seems a double edged sword if it leads to stuff like Pablo packing it in. But Blender is cool.